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November 08, 2005

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Jack

I'm sure you will see it eventually, but you might want to read my (very long) post at The Moderate Voice that attempts to bring the different aspects of the issue together.

Older Bro

And for a different take what is happening in France
http://www.comedycentral.com/shows/the_daily_show/videos/most_recent/index.jhtml
and click on the Burn Bébé Burn link.

Dave Schuler

I think that you, Jack, and I are largely on the same page.


These "youths" rioting are overwhelmingly Muslim, yes.

I'm not sure it's that clear-cut. Most of these kids aren't themselves immigrants (as we use the term) but the children or even the grandchildren of immigrants. I wouldn't be surprised if they're as Muslim as their français de souche counterparts are Catholic. Judging by the pictures I'm seeing many of those in the riots are descendants of sub-Saharan immigrants. Many of these immigrants were Christians or animists. You can't tell what their religion is/was by looking at them.

Daniel

Well, Dave, I'm admittedly going on reports from people I know in France (Jack included, of course) and the overwhelming concensus is that the rioters are of Algerian background and Muslim. However, I accept Jack's formulation that the fact that they are Muslim doesn't mean that Islam is at "fault."

The other thing that I have heard &mdash and read &mdash is that there is a growing presence of imams in the street, some who are trying to help the authorities quell the violence and some who are jockeying for position. That indicates to me a substantial Muslim presence. Again, I'm merely reporting what I have heard, not making a knee-jerk judgement based on the reports.

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